[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Ebonslayer]Ebonslayer[/url] said:[/b]

I hope it's not rude to reply to a topic I gave the idea for. I fear it may be seen as an excuse to share my characters more.

Walks-In-Darkness (Skyrim) goes through some character changes, most of the revolve around him realizing there's more to the world than your duty and he settles down by endgame and raises a family. Some of my many playthroughs with him even have him curing his vampirism to press the point that he's done fighting and will live and die a normal person.

However, I prefer the progression of his ancestor, Hides-In Shadow (Oblivion). He was a Shadowscale before being caught and sentenced for execution in the Imperial City. Near the beginning he is the average ***hole and really only cares about his pay. Over the course of the main quest, specifically during the Battle for Kvatch, he learns that there is more to the world than gold. He develops a friendship with the Blades and Martin and eventually saves the world a changed argonian, and after the main quest he drops contact with the Brotherhood forever. However, he didn't let his talents go to waste and acted as the Empire's personal assassin, killing any who think they can take advantage of the Empire's weakened state. He raised a family in Cloud Ruler Temple for years and passed on his skills to his children before he dissapeared while investigating reports of a portal to Oblivion near Bravil.

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I don't think it's rude, the way I figure it is that we should be sharing this stuff. We come here to give and take, provide inspiration and take some of our own. It is as Vivec has writen:

Vivec wandered into the Mourning Hold and found that Ayem was with a pair of lovers. Seht had divided himself again. Vivec then leapt through into their likenesses to observe, but he gained no secrets that he did not already know. He left a few of his own behind to make the journey worthwhile.

:) Even better when we see the secrets left behind take seed and grow to become build and/or profiles and blogs.

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Legion]Legion[/url] said:[/b]

In short, so I don't derail too hard -- he started out paranoid, but has since developed a meticulous and supercilious guy. But how he contracts the vampirism is actually the start of acr 2, because he's in Skyrim specifically to seek out Redwater Spring. I haven't decided if he cured himself to purposefully reinfect himself there, or if the tales of the Spring convinced him to become a vampire again. But I'm working on some ways of buffing vampiric drain. So much so that the build kind of hinges on it working like I want it to. So we'll see.

Anyway, Redwater Spring gives you Tainted Blood of the Ancients:

Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 1 day, but at the cost of 30 less health.

The progression from this is to the Bloodstone Chalice:

Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 1 days;
Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 3 days;
Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 5 days;
Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 7 days;
Your Vampiric Drain spell absorbs Magicka and Stamina from your victims for 9 days.

The level is determined by how many side quests of Ancient Power you've created. So you start with the shitty version, but work your way up to a much better version. 

So far I have arc 1 pretty hammered out. Brick (that's what I'm calling him for now) is in human form and spends his time securing alliances with Jarls and merchants, and preparing for the assault on Redwater Den.

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You've just given me an idea, that and the features you've put up including Tein's Artifact that I completely forgot about.

A long time ago, Vaz challenged me to create a vampire using that Blood of the Ancients in order to absorb enough magicka to be able to sustain a ward and the drain spell indefinitely. I stray off-topic, but it was a fun challenge.

I always believed that the biggest definer of how someone evolves or changes is the people they're around; in this case, I'm referring to guilds. A pompous, gold-seeking warrior will only keep that arrogance for so long around a group like the Companions, and a self-centered, cutthroat bandit will inevitably grow around a family like the Thieves' Guild. I usually model my character's position around who they're around. The Dark Brotherhood can lead to a strong taste for revenge, or perhaps even more taboo tastes, such as blood or flesh. The Mages could turn a bright-eyed scholar into a wizened master, or even a servant of Herma-Mora...

But I digress, you're only as good as your company, and I believe that applies to characters too. If my character joins an order, he'll likely begin to adopt mannerisms to fit their lifestyle.

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/SamuelWoody]Not-Always Lost[/url] said:[/b]

I always believed that the biggest definer of how someone evolves or changes is the people they're around; in this case, I'm referring to guilds. A pompous, gold-seeking warrior will only keep that arrogance for so long around a group like the Companions, and a self-centered, cutthroat bandit will inevitably grow around a family like the Thieves' Guild. I usually model my character's position around who they're around. The Dark Brotherhood can lead to a strong taste for revenge, or perhaps even more taboo tastes, such as blood or flesh. The Mages could turn a bright-eyed scholar into a wizened master, or even a servant of Herma-Mora...

But I digress, you're only as good as your company, and I believe that applies to characters too. If my character joins an order, he'll likely begin to adopt mannerisms to fit their lifestyle.

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I like this answer. A bright-eyed adventurer might stay that way through thick and thin, until some less than savoury folks show them they perks of stealing and banditry - peer pressure is a powerful tool, especially when a guild or god gets involved. The opposite could be true though, in a moment of clarity a thief could see the poor life decisions they made and go the opposite direction. But you're right, I think we need to take into account other people in a characters life when creating them, people are pack animals after all.

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Zonnonn]Zonnonn[/url] said:[/b]

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/SamuelWoody]Not-Always Lost[/url] said:[/b]

I always believed that the biggest definer of how someone evolves or changes is the people they're around; in this case, I'm referring to guilds. A pompous, gold-seeking warrior will only keep that arrogance for so long around a group like the Companions, and a self-centered, cutthroat bandit will inevitably grow around a family like the Thieves' Guild. I usually model my character's position around who they're around. The Dark Brotherhood can lead to a strong taste for revenge, or perhaps even more taboo tastes, such as blood or flesh. The Mages could turn a bright-eyed scholar into a wizened master, or even a servant of Herma-Mora...

But I digress, you're only as good as your company, and I believe that applies to characters too. If my character joins an order, he'll likely begin to adopt mannerisms to fit their lifestyle.

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I like this answer. A bright-eyed adventurer might stay that way through thick and thin, until some less than savoury folks show them they perks of stealing and banditry - peer pressure is a powerful tool, especially when a guild or god gets involved. The opposite could be true though, in a moment of clarity a thief could see the poor life decisions they made and go the opposite direction. But you're right, I think we need to take into account other people in a characters life when creating them, people are pack animals after all.

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People are what they eat, too. But I change the subject, the above is insightful and peer preasure or herd-mentality plays a huge role in determining how someone acts in a given enviroment. Recently I had to go on this course, and a small part of it was the scripted behaviour, and videos were shown of a group of actors in a room plus one random dude who had no idea what he was in for. Then smoke was introduced and the actors were under orders not to react. In most cases the random bloke stayed in that room for... fuck it, here's the vid for those interested.

Anyway, I know that's slightly off-topic, but can demonstrate both for and against how a person behaves in a given grpup.

Then there is the inverse of Not Always Lost's points. You know that one guy who you like one on one but he never quite fits into the group you hang with? He always has that slightly different point of view, or his philosophy and outlook never quite gels with that of the majority. It's enough that he would become your shield-brother and you know you can count on him, but in a group he's the one most likely to argue with the status quo. Sometimes that dude can be interesting to think of, how inecure he must feel, or how much he feels he needs to change himself to fit in? At what point does he say, "fuck this"?

The Companions makes this stand out. Up until you discover the Circle are werewolves it was a dream. Then you realise that you share Kdlaak's pov, or that both points of view on the lycanthropy issue are flawed. A moment like that could lead to a progression most unexpected.

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Paws]Paws[/url] said:[/b]

People are what they eat, too. But I change the subject, the above is insightful and peer preasure or herd-mentality plays a huge role in determining how someone acts in a given enviroment. Recently I had to go on this course, and a small part of it was the scripted behaviour, and videos were shown of a group of actors in a room plus one random dude who had no idea what he was in for. Then smoke was introduced and the actors were under orders not to react. In most cases the random bloke stayed in that room for... fuck it, here's the vid for those interested.

Anyway, I know that's slightly off-topic, but can demonstrate both for and against how a person behaves in a given grpup.

Then there is the inverse of Not Always Lost's points. You know that one guy who you like one on one but he never quite fits into the group you hang with? He always has that slightly different point of view, or his philosophy and outlook never quite gels with that of the majority. It's enough that he would become your shield-brother and you know you can count on him, but in a group he's the one most likely to argue with the status quo. Sometimes that dude can be interesting to think of, how inecure he must feel, or how much he feels he needs to change himself to fit in? At what point does he say, "fuck this"?

The Companions makes this stand out. Up until you discover the Circle are werewolves it was a dream. Then you realise that you share Kdlaak's pov, or that both points of view on the lycanthropy issue are flawed. A moment like that could lead to a progression most unexpected.

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Ah yes, I remember seeing some stuff like this before. Like the social experiment when everyone's facing one direction in a lift, so when someone new comes in they face that way as well, even if its odd.

You make a good point though, about the outlier in a group who never seems completely there. You could make the argument that some people just like to be different, and regardless of the situation they go against the grain. In fact its probably a pretty accurate representation of the LDB they always do something different to others no matter what guild, it just happens that it pays off for them.

Passion may also be a factor - Vilkas and Farkas were raised in the Companions with all the ideals and views of the organisation thrust upon them. They do what the guild does, no matter what. But then there's members like Torvar, warriors they may be, but with none of the passion of the cause that they Circle has, he just likes to hit stuff and drink. And although he rarely deviates, probably due to his low rank and lack of giving a shit, if he somehow climber the ranks to get in the Circle (unlikely though because of said lack of passion), I imagine he'd be one to question the decisions of the Harbringer where Vilkas wouldn't.

And like you said, insecurity could also cause dissent. Njada Stone-Arm is surrounded by the greatest warriors in Skyrim, legends among the people she grew up with. She could brown nose her way up to the top, but she could also feel insecure and try to prove herself by striking out on her own - chasing down the leader of a bandit group to prove her worth, its a trope used by writers all the time, especially in fantasy and sci fi.

Heh, looking back I'm not sure what I'm getting at by writing this. Maybe that every scenario has two split paths I guess?

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Zonnonn]Zonnonn[/url] said:[/b]

Ah yes, I remember seeing some stuff like this before. Like the social experiment when everyone's facing one direction in a lift, so when someone new comes in they face that way as well, even if its odd.

You make a good point though, about the outlier in a group who never seems completely there. You could make the argument that some people just like to be different, and regardless of the situation they go against the grain. In fact its probably a pretty accurate representation of the LDB they always do something different to others no matter what guild, it just happens that it pays off for them.

Passion may also be a factor - Vilkas and Farkas were raised in the Companions with all the ideals and views of the organisation thrust upon them. They do what the guild does, no matter what. But then there's members like Torvar, warriors they may be, but with none of the passion of the cause that they Circle has, he just likes to hit stuff and drink. And although he rarely deviates, probably due to his low rank and lack of giving a shit, if he somehow climber the ranks to get in the Circle (unlikely though because of said lack of passion), I imagine he'd be one to question the decisions of the Harbringer where Vilkas wouldn't.

And like you said, insecurity could also cause dissent. Njada Stone-Arm is surrounded by the greatest warriors in Skyrim, legends among the people she grew up with. She could brown nose her way up to the top, but she could also feel insecure and try to prove herself by striking out on her own - chasing down the leader of a bandit group to prove her worth, its a trope used by writers all the time, especially in fantasy and sci fi.

Heh, looking back I'm not sure what I'm getting at by writing this. Maybe that every scenario has two split paths I guess?

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Ha, I haven't seen that video but I can picture it so clearly :D

I like that you have singled out Torvar and Njada. I have a soft spot for Stone-Arm and can imagine that scenario, her sense of self is as formidable as her block skills. Doesn't she even have words of advice on blocking for the senior members? As for Torvar, yeah, dude doesn't give a shit. Part of me would like to see him as a Circle member just for the giggles, I imagine he'd be a total troll.

I hear you about the rambling point. Split paths, choices, factors influencing progression of a character... What's next?

[blockquote][b][url=/profile/Paws]Paws[/url] said:[/b]

Ha, I haven't seen that video but I can picture it so clearly :D

I like that you have singled out Torvar and Njada. I have a soft spot for Stone-Arm and can imagine that scenario, her sense of self is as formidable as her block skills. Doesn't she even have words of advice on blocking for the senior members? As for Torvar, yeah, dude doesn't give a shit. Part of me would like to see him as a Circle member just for the giggles, I imagine he'd be a total troll.

I hear you about the rambling point. Split paths, choices, factors influencing progression of a character... What's next?

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Njada might've been a bad example actually, she's probably one of the most compotent members of the Companions as a whole, even in the Circle. But being so low ranking while actually being one of the best fighters there must be proper annoying, like going to school and being smarter than your teachers. Torvar is basically the opposite to her, taking his junior role in stride by doing as little as possible while remembering as little as possible.

Thinking about this has actually made me like the Companions a bit more. They always seemed a little two dimensional to me, but I can see a little more depth in them now, or maybe thats just me overthinking their characters... Eh, if it works it works.

Wulf, my main character - plus blog character - started out incredibly hostile towards his Beast Side. However, after meeting Aela, fighting off vampires, led him to embrace his wolf side - he still sees himself as a heroic character, but the Wolf Form is no longer something to be feared - it's something to be helped with, embraced. I've found this incredibly fun to roleplay!