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A Roleplayer's Copybook: The Lazy Bard Challenge

Tags: #RP  #Story  #Challenge  #Writing 
  • December 28, 2018

    Well, first of all, neither the Ayleids nor the Direnni are the best examples of elves. There are reasons why they left Alinor in the first place. Also, the perception elves have of men stems from their low culture, ignorance and lack of desire to learn. I never said that Nedes were warmongering, but they were barbarians, it's a known fact. I'm pretty sure they hadn't even invented letters (they used the elven ones). The only exception is probably Redguards. Elves saw men as a disposable resource because they were useless for anything else. And then there appeared one or two men who were smarter than a sheep, they realized that elves can bleed too, and told them rest of the herd to run to kill them, so that person can become the new master. This is how it was with each human empire. And it repeated again and again.

    Btw, Redguards never hated elves, they killed them and Nedes all the same. They just wanted the land)

  • Member
    December 28, 2018

    Oh the history of Redguards and Elves goes way back in Yokuda but in Hamerfell yeah they didn't care much they just killed anyone that was over there for the land. Check this out --> Click Here

    The Direnni were Altmer and didn't change much if anything in their Altmeri culture compared to the Altmers. This doesn't make any sense or justifies the way they treated and used Men it only shows that they were stupid and greedy despite their culture in this regard. Men might have been barbarians but still had a certain degree of agriculture and hunting and low basic production in order to survive even if they were barbarians. It's not that they were useless for everything else it was just that Elves didn't try to teach them and were also greedy and not that different from the Men of later ages, actually if you see the lore they appear to have zero points in any aspect of Humanitarian culture be it Altmer, Direnni, Ayleids, Snow Elves, Dunmer. It was very easy for such cultures like they had back then to oversee and train them and make Men into a productive force it's just that they never wanted to do that and they only wanted to treat Men as animals. They could very easily rule them, teach them the basics of production like agriculture or do heavy lifting works like mining etc and use them as just plebs and low class citizens for production. Nobody is born knowing everything, they could teach them and use them as workers without enforcing all the other things they enforced and having their status being lower than animals which in return only induced hatred. The thing that they were barbarians is not an excuse it just shows that the elven superiority the Altmer have in their mind which is true because they have a more advanced culture than Men is also something that has gotten over their heads and drove them in their worst possible choises over the years. 

    Same goes for Elves the Thalmor for example overthrew the previous Altmer Kings/Queens and the rest of Altmer nobility and took all power to their hands, I don't think this would have been done in a friendly manner and if you think what this entails for any society the undercurrent over there should smell like gunpowder. These types of "smarter" individuals exist in both Men and Mer.

  • December 28, 2018

    We don't really know what happened in Yokuda. It could have easily been elves trying to stop the Redguards from destroying their own continent. Also we have no data of what those elves were like.

    The Direnni, unlike the Ayleids, weren't overthrown by some men, they dimply ceased to exist as elves because they mixed their blood with men. The last members of that clan were all men. That was their mistake.

    Also, lol, they didn't owe the men anything. They didn't have to teach them or make their lives better or care about them in any way. It's a very slave-like, to think that someone big and poweful should come and make your life better, teach you, feed you and whatever. The elven culture is about striving for perfection, it doesn't endorse tolerance for those who don't want to improve, be they men or elves. The Altmer (the ones in Alinor) never went to conquer and enslave any men. Nor have the Snow Elves enslaved anyone. The Dunmer and the Ayleids worshipped Daedra, and Daedra worshippers aren't exactly known for constructive and cultured customs.

    And the Thalmor overthrowing kings... well, I'd take everything in that particular book with a bucket of salt. At least as long as there is no other source confirming it, or any evidence.

  • Member
    December 28, 2018

    Most likely it was just another fight for supremacy but the Redguards have a dislike for the Elves since back then.

    This has actually nothing to do with making their lives better quite the opposite it is just a way of management and making their lives equally as shit but rather than animals having them as actual serfs but not exploit them to such a degree that they will go out of their way to kill you at some point. They wouldn't improve their life at all and they wouldn't do their lives better or meaningfull lol. Their lives still would be down in the gutters and much worse compared to before but at the very least the humans wouldn't go against them to kill at the first chance they got when their masters were weakened. The elves wouldn't go about imparting them any high tier knowledge or feed them better but just the basics so they can be used as a productive force and use the carrot and stick approach so they wouldn't have so much hatred that they would rise against them, for example the Bretons are not a product of consent and love between elves and humans.

    I think the Direnni actually ceased to exist because they were left broke after the war against the Alessian Empire and the riots of the humans under them. Bretons couldn't take high positions in their clan nor could they marry any Elf. Elves still had the high management positions although not many talented ones were left after the war thus they were gone at some point.

    I don't know even though I prefer Altmer culture with the way Bethesda went about portraying Thalmor in game it made it so they never sit well with me, not because of the #Thalmor/ElvesAreRacist many go about but they just made them look (to me at least) like the group to take stupid management decisions if they were to conquer men and repeat the mistakes of others. The amount of Elven Supremacy they have is too damn high and Men are like cockroaches they will come out from somewhere at some point again. Also it 's not unlikely to pull another wild Shezzar appeared type of thing to keep the balance. With the dumbing down and shit writting I saw in Skyrim I really wouldn't be surprised to see w/e random shit being pulled off by Bethesda at this point.

  • December 29, 2018

    That is likely too, but I've never encountered any data about Redguards particularly hating elves.


    I never said the Direnni were doing anyone lives better, I said they weren't obliged to do so. As for the men, well, when someone else making your life shitty you can go and kill them, but if you are making your life shitty then oops, you have no one to kill but yourself. Most prefer blaming someone or something else instead of admitting it was their own fault though.

    Also, the Direnni didn't cease to exist, nor were they killed by any men, especially not after the war against the Alessian Empire. Their clan still existed by the time of Daggerfall, but  y that time they were no longer an elven clan, having assimilated within the Breton population.


    As for Altmer and the Thalmor, lol, maybe they seem racist to you, but I personally hardly can blame them. I kind of know how it feels to be in their shoes and why they are the way they are. Lol, I guess some people might even call me a racist as well. I've had to deal with some immigrants who come to work in my country and some of these guys don't know that a computer and a vacuum cleaner need electricity to work, cannot tell time by a clock and cannot wipe dust from a windowsill even after you give them a step-by-step instruction. I'm not exaggerating, these people are really like that. So somehow, I don't have a very high opinion on these perticular nations, and upon meeting one of those I will expect something of the aforementioned rather than a normal person, and I wouldn't be very thrilled about one of them being my colleague or neighbor. And being friends with one of them? Dating one of them? Not an option, totally. So maybe I'm just as racist as the Thalmor.


    I wouldn't be surprised by anything from Bethesda at this point. They don't respect even their own reputation, I completely fail to understand any reasons behind that, so I'll just sit and wait and expect nothing good.

  • Member
    December 30, 2018
    Cool story. Racism is bad, m’kay?
  • December 30, 2018

    Who says it's good? But is this really racism? I really don't care what color is anyone's skin, everyone is human all the same. But when the majority of a certain race or nation behaves in a certain way, is it so wrong and bad to not want to have anything to do with them? It's not because of their race, it's because of their customs and behavior. Also, I'm pretty certain that had I gone to America or any other normal country, people there would look at me just like I look at those immigrant fellows, and that is normal, because in their eyes I would be the same kind of illiterate savage. In the real world this has little to do with race. In TES though, race and culture correlate in 99% of cases.

  • Member
    December 31, 2018

    Yeah that's why I 'm saying if they had a better understanding of how to rule serfs and didn't exploit the shit out of them nor underestimated them they wouldn't have to suffer all the rebelions later on, Direnni and the rest of the Elves like Ayleids and Snow Elves were just slowly digging their own graves. 

    Actually my problem has nothing to do with racism that's why I put the /hashtag above and was sarcastic about it. Every race in ES can be called racist one way or another if we take the meaning of the word by dictionary and not what they are turning it into which is a buzzword but anyways with the Elves or at least those who govern the various Elves we 've seen up until now Direnni, Ayleids, Snow Elves and Altmer 4E they all have one thing in common all of them thought themselves to be above Men which is true if we take it from the side of knowledge, magic, culture and all that but this sentiment got to them and made them take irrational decisions that completely destroyed them. The Altmer at the moment or at least the ones rulling them seem to behave in the same way the previous elves behaved and Bethesda made everything they could in game so we get that message. These types of overly excited leaders have a higher chance to make a mistake, it has already happened three times and we saw where that went.

    That being said I don't think much will change between Empire and AD with ES6 lore and they might pull the higher enemy/danger card that will overshadow the Empire vs AD thing. The title of ES6 is already dramatic with the Fall in it to show that some shit will go down, most likely some major bad will come and we will be taken by the hand since level 1 with monumental dumbing down and go on to become the leader of every faction that will probably have some questlines with 8-10 quests and an average of 3 hours content and save Tamriel in the process. I 'm expecting a lot of random shit and bandaid tactics in ES6 lore. There is also the factor of ESO which might change the lore som way or another by the time ES6 comes out because the thing with ESO is that the developers are puting out content to sell and the writers are told "Hey write something to make this shit work" sad but true because they do not write a book they are making a game first and the story comes as secondary that is also why many things are left ambiguous left and right in lore, this is apparent with every other title mostly up to Oblivion.

  • December 31, 2018

    Snow Elves never had sny serfs, where did you even take that? As for the Direnni, I suspect they simply didn't know what to do with those humans and didn't really care. They probably left Alinor to find a place where they could practice whatever dark or apraxic stuff they practiced that was forbidden in their homeland, and found those humans living there. They didn't plan or want to have a kingdom of humans but they had to do something with them. So they did. In a lazy and ignorant way because tgey didn't care.


    Once again, Snow Elves never ruled any state of men. And 4E Altmer don't either. The guys you see in Skyrim are not rulers, they are the lowest of the low. There are only a few people who make the decisions and these guys are actually the ones who seem the least racist lol. Peasants are never smart, even Altmeri peasants. And that's what the Thalmor you see in Skyrim are, regular grunts. Also they don't rule anything but their Dominion. The Empire is destroying itself by itsrlf, they are just helping it a bit.


    And you are giving too much credit to the idiot that is now the lead writer at Bethesda. Higher enrmy? Why bother? They'll just tell you that evil Daedra worshipping Thalmor want to destroy the world (their religious vies contradict their goal but who cares) and you will have to kill them all the time you aren't killing undead or spiders. And you will be doing it as a vampire, just for more fun. And all of this will be going on in Hammerfell, and who cares that there haven't been any Thalmor for 20 years at least.

  • Member
    December 31, 2018

    Oh I mentioned snow elves just from the perspective of using a simillar more violent approach like the others and underestimating the backlash from Men after their actions with the whole Night of Tears thing.

    The thing is not what they actually are in Skyrim but what Bethesda wants them to be in general and if they say they are that then they are. They want to picture them like some sort of vilains at least that 's what they did in Skyrim for the common man/player. They went full force to make the Thalmor look as bad as they could and this made people who don't know much about TES lore (I don't know much as well but at least I know the basics) think that all Elves now are some bloodthirsty people caring only about Elven Supremacy and are always out there to kill and eradicate any man they come across and that will stick until they put in some lore that will explain a few more things about 4E Altmer.  Although this in return was another thing to create some sort of hype for Skyrim and Nords because Vikings are cool and sell so people might buy a few more repacks of Skyrim as long as they have the hype that they save the world and kill all the bad elves because #FreedomOrSovngarde along with dragons, undeads etc. But yeah all in all first goes the game then the lore.

    Actually in regards to the lead writer it's been some time since he changed his twitter bio to say that he is now Design Director at BGS rather than lead writer. If that is good or not I 'm not sure because Design Director means he will probably have a say on all sorts of things in regards to the game. But to be honest I expect a lame dumbed down to hell story for sure, gotta aim for all those 7 year old kids on the switch lol. I 've been looking a bit in Daggerfall and Morrowind the linear decline in content is obvious, I 'm actually going to get Daggerfall and Morrowind to play a bit just for the story.